Is Atlas actually Astro with no restraints?

[Satus]

I am super late to this thread, but...

I don't believe the omega factor and outward appearances were the only difference between Astro and Atlas. I think if Astro did have the omega factor, he'd still have his own unique personality that is different from Atlas'. Therefore, it would be difficult to know how much Astro would have done the same in Atlas' place.

However ignoring that detail, I think all these theories are fun to read. Especially the Star Wars related comparisons.

[jeffbert]

I was intending to save that for my book, but you guys made me post it now, lest someone else do it first.

[AprilSeven]

Jeffbert that will still be an important part of your book!

I had a rather unique experience "absorbing" the Astro Boy canons -- first
American 1960's; then the 2003 series, then the movie, some of the manga and this past month, the 1980's.

The 80's series - which at first I shunned - is quite remarkable not only because of the quality of animation, but the obvious impact of 2001 Space Odyssey and Star Wars on Dr. Tezuka. He really, really attempted to meaningfully update Astro's story so it would still feel futuristic. I don't think the 2003 version did that as effectively: the Art Deco/Steampunk design style is unique, but I'm not sure if that's what Tezuka would have envisioned (probably something more like the movie).

@Satus - putting aside Astro and Atlas' different "upbringings" couldn't you picture Astro WITH Omega Factor not tolerating Hamegg's abusive behavior? :d evil: The whole point is, his AI is designed to default towards compassion and gentleness, even though he's packing 100,000hp, lasers in his fingers and guns in his buns.

That's why the Prime Minister ordered Tenma to destroy Astro before he activated him - he was too dangerous to take a chance with. So of course Guiss builds an Astro without any restrictions on his AI at all, and the Omega Factor, so he has COMPLETELY free will, and the "ability" to commit evil.

This whole point was lost on me because I didn't understand they are basically the same robot (seeing Atlas as an adult through me off; I hadn't realize he rebuilt himself).

Funny -- last year there was a joke going around the Forum about Astro asking his father for a Belly Button for Christmas. Astro with Omega Factor would just take care of that little upgrade all on his own! :d oh:

Yup, Astro was my prototype for the PEACEKEEPER!!

[Androids101]

In my opinion, although Atlas and Astro as the same physcially, mentally they are very different - and not only because of the Omega Factor, one was brought up by Elefun to be good, the other by Skunk to be bad.

[Satus]

In my opinion, although Atlas and Astro as the same physcially, mentally they are very different - and not only because of the Omega Factor, one was brought up by Elefun to be good, the other by Skunk to be bad.

I agree.

@Satus - putting aside Astro and Atlas' different "upbringings" couldn't you picture Astro WITH Omega Factor not tolerating Hamegg's abusive behavior? :d evil: The whole point is, his AI is designed to default towards compassion and gentleness, even though he's packing 100,000hp, lasers in his fingers and guns in his buns.

That's why the Prime Minister ordered Tenma to destroy Astro before he activated him - he was too dangerous to take a chance with. So of course Guiss builds an Astro without any restrictions on his AI at all, and the Omega Factor, so he has COMPLETELY free will, and the "ability" to commit evil.

I can imagine Astro would have been less tolerable of Hamegg, but I can't picture him trying to outright murder Hamegg, like Atlas tried to do to Guiss.

The Prime Minister's reaction is understandable. But if the Omega Factor is just designed to give more free will and 'be more human like', it seems strange to assume Astro would instantly be a bad person because of Hamegg. Because not all people become bad from their bad experiences either, personalities can affect decisions. However if Astro did become bad from Hamegg's actions, it would certainly be an odd but interesting thing to see.

This whole point was lost on me because I didn't understand they are basically the same robot (seeing Atlas as an adult through me off; I hadn't realize he rebuilt himself).

That is interesting as well. I wonder what kind of perspective it creates never realizing Astro and Atlas are built from the same design? I already assumed young and old Atlas were the same (besides the obvious differences) the first time I watched the 80's version, so I never got to have such a perspective.

[fafner]

The Prime Minister's reaction is understandable. But if the Omega Factor is just designed to give more free will and 'be more human like', it seems strange to assume Astro would instantly be a bad person because of Hamegg. Because not all people become bad from their bad experiences either, personalities can affect decisions. However if Astro did become bad from Hamegg's actions, it would certainly be an odd but interesting thing to see.

It is not assuming that Astro would instantly become a bad person, it is more the fear that he might. And with such a tremendous amount of power, it is legitimate that people would worry

[jeffbert]

In my opinion, although Atlas and Astro as the same physcially, mentally they are very different - and not only because of the Omega Factor, one was brought up by Elefun to be good, the other by Skunk to be bad.

We are merely speculating, so here is my input: I think that without the Omega Factor, Atlas may have become timid as a lamb. Tenma designed the AI, & I doubt he would have made provision for his 100 kHp robot to become angry or even recklessly upset. Imagine the damage from even a mild tantrum! We do know that when Atom had been in Hamegg's circus for even a day, he was whipped and tongue-lashed. Though Atom had previously been loved by Tenma, & though he should have thus rejected this new situation based upon his memories of that love, he cowered instead of standing up for himself.

Atlas, on the other hand, really had no initial love other than the few times Livian was with him. He was abused from the start. Without the Omega Factor, would he have been defiant of his masters? No, he would more likely than not, have been even more sheepish toward Guiss & Skunk, than Atom was toward Hamegg. Granted, his personality would indeed be different, more like the worker robot Count Burg was thrashing as Maria looked-on in horror (DH vol 19).

[Androids101]

@Satus - putting aside Astro and Atlas' different "upbringings" couldn't you picture Astro WITH Omega Factor not tolerating Hamegg's abusive behavior? The whole point is, his AI is designed to default towards compassion and gentleness, even though he's packing 100,000hp, lasers in his fingers and guns in his buns.

That's why the Prime Minister ordered Tenma to destroy Astro before he activated him - he was too dangerous to take a chance with. So of course Guiss builds an Astro without any restrictions on his AI at all, and the Omega Factor, so he has COMPLETELY free will, and the "ability" to commit evil.

So in a sense Astro is still not an entirely 'free' robot? Abused by his father, then abused by a circus person...its amazing how Astro never decided to retaliate...

Atlas, on the other hand, really had no initial love other than the few times Livian was with him. He was abused from the start. Without the Omega Factor, would he have been defiant of his masters? No, he would more likely than not, have been even more sheepish toward Guiss & Skunk, than Atom was toward Hamegg.

That would indeed be interesting

[AprilSeven]

Kinda makes you wonder . . . people who are significantly "evil" (thinking of mass murderer Charles Manson - or $$-stealing Bernie Madoff!) - do they have the "human equivalent" to an Omega Factor?

Although it's been scientifically documented that - for example - children raised in abusive homes, are more likely to become abusive themselves . . . it doesn't ALWAYS happen. What makes the difference?

It's also important to note that once Atlas understood that Astro was truly his brother, he began to soften a little and change. And his final act was to save his brother - so he did, in the end, turn "good." And Astro's caring for him (and Livian's stance) seemed to make it possible.

love conquers all I guess!

Snap!!! That's what I've been saying, people!!!