AstroBoy Online Forums

I've been wondering ,with the 3D cash grab for the Lion King down the corner, about The Lion King. Indisputably , it is now seen as not only one of the best Disney films, but also a ripoff of Kimba. But from my observances of both series, there's only the rough version of the Kimba story in it and with no humans, I find it lacking due to that but nonetheless I love it as it was my very first film I saw in theaters and it got me into Kimba itself.

It's been said, even by those inside the production itself, that the film was a planned high budget remake of our favorite white lion using Kimba's original name being Simba and he himself being white . So , had Disney won the rights to the franchise in the 80's, how different would the film really be from the anime and manga? How would the characters be changed?

First things first, I recall from the KimbaWLion website that the first and nearly finalized titles being "The King of the Jungle" and the "The Jungle King". But would those been the possible subtitles of the Kimba film?

I would like to see your input on how Disney would've handled Kimba.

I've never read of The Lion King being originally planned as a re-make of Kimba the White Lion, even if there is a picture of a white lion playing. According to most of the sites, despite the relations a remake was officially denied, and they said that it is independent.

If Disney had won the rights, the film probably wouldn't have been too much different - just Simba replaced by Kimba, I guess. Disney probably would have worked out the plot, and it wouldn't have been a complete remake of the series in my opinion. I do not know if Disney ever acquired the rights or not, but it seems strange for a large movie company to basically write a film which is exceedingly similar to a Japanese anime and manga, and even the main character's name is really alike.

lets just say i only read the title of this thread. which i did... but that doesn't matter.
DOOM.

Well Disney wound't want to have anything to do with it after the lion king came out anyway but the reason you come up with this is because of the 1965 anime right ?

well every Tezuka fan knows that that series was dumbed down because the American sponsor NBC Enterprises that simply wanted to pay tons of money to get what they wanted a Bambi like story and din't want real violence and blood etc.

I know that Disney in the past made more mature stories they even animated a short film about adolf Hitler and some more Natzi stuff but they don't really do that anymore do they ever since they have been focusing on that 3D Crap they only have been making very childish works i don't even think DR Tezuka woud have been a fan of the Disney of today if i say so myself.

Of course disney has always done works like that but in the past there still was some violence and deep thoughts into there stories and stuff and they don't have that anymore do they ?
so there you go.

"Androids101" wrote:I've never read of The Lion King being originally planned as a re-make of Kimba the White Lion, even if there is a picture of a white lion playing. According to most of the sites, despite the relations a remake was officially denied, and they said that it is independent.

If Disney had won the rights, the film probably wouldn't have been too much different - just Simba replaced by Kimba, I guess. Disney probably would have worked out the plot, and it wouldn't have been a complete remake of the series in my opinion. I do not know if Disney ever acquired the rights or not, but it seems strange for a large movie company to basically write a film which is exceedingly similar to a Japanese anime and manga, and even the main character's name is really alike.

http://www.kimbawlion.com/rant2.htm

From my reading of this page ,I can only gather that they were allegedly fighting for the rights in the 70's and 80's to make the film and though they owned the rights much like what happened with the Muppets.

They though they had the rights , but when it was found otherwise ,basically , that fell through so they changed Simba's coat , any inferred human parts dominated by Tezuka characters were excised and changed Kimba's partners from an antelope split to Timon and Pumbaa with Polly being the blue bird guy. Then they added really awesome musical scenes ,referenced Hamlet and Sundiata and we got TLK.

No joke ,they mentioned it many times , even Roy Disney and Broderick themselves did. And with key frames and story paralleling the rough plot of Kimba ,it is a no brainer. They even mentioned it in TV Guide for crying out loud lol.

I do agree with you it might have not been much different, but with the human dynamic in it and it being called Kimba, it might have been slightly different for said human plot. The only problem is the beginning with the depictions of Africans and said first few episodes with humans, but that could all have been rewritten to have been in the same rough location and putting more emphasis into his kingdom of the Jungle. But with only 89 minutes to do everything in Kimba AND Leo the lion, it would have to keep the pacing of the final film plus show Higeoyaji and his nephew raising Kimba and then staying in the jungle?

The best thing which would have happened would be less of those hyenas and Hamegg as the minor villain especially if they were as much of poachers as in the series with the Uncle being the major villain.

But , maybe I'm reading too much into this...?

"Tetsuwan Atom" wrote:Well Disney wound't want to have anything to do with it after the lion king came out anyway but the reason you come up with this is because of the 1965 anime right ?

well every Tezuka fan knows that that series was dumbed down because the American sponsor NBC Enterprises that simply wanted to pay tons of money to get what they wanted a Bambi like story and din't want real violence and blood etc.

I know that Disney in the past made more mature stories they even animated a short film about adolf Hitler and some more Natzi stuff but they don't really do that anymore do they ever since they have been focusing on that 3D Crap they only have been making very childish works i don't even think DR Tezuka woud have been a fan of the Disney of today if i say so myself.

Of course disney has always done works like that but in the past there still was some violence and deep thoughts into there stories and stuff and they don't have that anymore do they ?
so there you go.

What I meant in my first post was would the The Lion King be any different if Disney had gotten the rights to the Kimba anime like they planned and did their remake .

I do agree the Dr. Tezuka would not be pleased with how Disney has become but on the other hand, he'd be more pleased about Pixar ,Dreamworks and the animation explosion of the 90's in the States. I have often wondered if had Tezuka not died and lived for an extra 20 years, he might have worked on Avatar: TLA with Mike and Bryan or Avatar would strongly be influenced by that if it already wasn't. After hearing about Tezuka's Three Eyed One in comparison, Avatar is like its homage.Even Yugi-Oh , which was a more direct homage, was not as close as Avatar. Just look at Aang in comparison to that kid. It makes me wonder...

Wow...I never realised that they were that much alike, from the thorns to the stampede...

If Disney did make a re-make, however (which nowadays they probably will not do, given the fact that they already made TLK and its two sequels) instead of The Lion King, maybe Disney did not want the plot to be a complete replica of Kimba's, even if they were very much alike? I honestly have no idea... Disney officially denied the claim, saying it is extremely coincedental, and no-one except for the people at Disney knows if they ever tried to acquire the rights or not, and even if they did apparently they did not succeed.

As for the human parts, I really don't see the fact that humans have to be in every film involving animals, with humans always playing out the villains and stuff. Kimba was the original one to introduce this I guess, and originally the plot was great, but now everyone is doing it. Originally the 'human-animal relationships' were good, but nowadays is it getting a bit repetitive? If I speak about The Lion King, and not about Kimba the White Lion (pretending that I've never heard of Kimba), if The Lion King also featured humans in any way, I personally believe that film would be absolutely ruined.
I actually watched The Lion King when I was about 5-6 years old or so, and I thought that it was actually a damn good movie. Then, I have not heard about Kimba the White Lion or the alleged copyright claims. It's kind of just a pity that Disney did not make a Kimba re-make instead of their own, and then the humans are okay since it is a remake.

Or maybe Disney themselves think that their plot is the best...?

"Tetsuwan Atom" wrote:Well Disney wound't want to have anything to do with it after the lion king came out anyway but the reason you come up with this is because of the 1965 anime right ?

well every Tezuka fan knows that that series was dumbed down because the American sponsor NBC Enterprises that simply wanted to pay tons of money to get what they wanted a Bambi like story and din't want real violence and blood etc.

I know that Disney in the past made more mature stories they even animated a short film about adolf Hitler and some more Natzi stuff but they don't really do that anymore do they ever since they have been focusing on that 3D Crap they only have been making very childish works i don't even think DR Tezuka woud have been a fan of the Disney of today if i say so myself.

Of course disney has always done works like that but in the past there still was some violence and deep thoughts into there stories and stuff and they don't have that anymore do they ?
so there you go.

"Androids101" wrote:Wow...I never realised that they were that much alike, from the thorns to the stampede...

If Disney did make a re-make, however (which nowadays they probably will not do, given the fact that they already made TLK and its two sequels) instead of The Lion King, maybe Disney did not want the plot to be a complete replica of Kimba's, even if they were very much alike? I honestly have no idea... Disney officially denied the claim, saying it is extremely coincedental, and no-one except for the people at Disney knows if they ever tried to acquire the rights or not, and even if they did apparently they did not succeed.

As for the human parts, I really don't see the fact that humans have to be in every film involving animals, with humans always playing out the villains and stuff. Kimba was the original one to introduce this I guess, and originally the plot was great, but now everyone is doing it. Originally the 'human-animal relationships' were good, but nowadays is it getting a bit repetitive? If I speak about The Lion King, and not about Kimba the White Lion (pretending that I've never heard of Kimba), if The Lion King also featured humans in any way, I personally believe that film would be absolutely ruined.
I actually watched The Lion King when I was about 5-6 years old or so, and I thought that it was actually a damn good movie. Then, I have not heard about Kimba the White Lion or the alleged copyright claims. It's kind of just a pity that Disney did not make a Kimba re-make instead of their own, and then the humans are okay since it is a remake.

Or maybe Disney themselves think that their plot is the best...?

The human plot ,while a bit unnecessary , did provide a backbone to the series but it is overdone in the traditional sense. If The Lion King was a remake, I could see humans being the minor characters /villains at best while the animals are at the forefront like Rise of the Planet of the Apes because otherwise, the film would not be as good. I agree with you on that.

But if it were done as Kimba , I think it would have possibly diverted from the dub and took direct inspiration from the manga because Disney wasn't afraid to have deaths and some violence as NBC was. And since it's animated and Disney, they could get away with it . I do like Timon and Pumbaa though.

What if Disney got the rights to Kimba?

Well...The Lion King would just get a title change to 'Kimba'

I think they've already shown how they'd handle it.
With matching characters and identical scenes.

"Bigdog" wrote:[QUOTE=Tetsuwan Atom;170442]Well Disney wound't want to have anything to do with it after the lion king came out anyway but the reason you come up with this is because of the 1965 anime right ?

well every Tezuka fan knows that that series was dumbed down because the American sponsor NBC Enterprises that simply wanted to pay tons of money to get what they wanted a Bambi like story and din't want real violence and blood etc.

I know that Disney in the past made more mature stories they even animated a short film about adolf Hitler and some more Natzi stuff but they don't really do that anymore do they ever since they have been focusing on that 3D Crap they only have been making very childish works i don't even think DR Tezuka woud have been a fan of the Disney of today if i say so myself.

Of course disney has always done works like that but in the past there still was some violence and deep thoughts into there stories and stuff and they don't have that anymore do they ?
so there you go.

"Androids101" wrote:Wow...I never realised that they were that much alike, from the thorns to the stampede...

If Disney did make a re-make, however (which nowadays they probably will not do, given the fact that they already made TLK and its two sequels) instead of The Lion King, maybe Disney did not want the plot to be a complete replica of Kimba's, even if they were very much alike? I honestly have no idea... Disney officially denied the claim, saying it is extremely coincedental, and no-one except for the people at Disney knows if they ever tried to acquire the rights or not, and even if they did apparently they did not succeed.

As for the human parts, I really don't see the fact that humans have to be in every film involving animals, with humans always playing out the villains and stuff. Kimba was the original one to introduce this I guess, and originally the plot was great, but now everyone is doing it. Originally the 'human-animal relationships' were good, but nowadays is it getting a bit repetitive? If I speak about The Lion King, and not about Kimba the White Lion (pretending that I've never heard of Kimba), if The Lion King also featured humans in any way, I personally believe that film would be absolutely ruined.
I actually watched The Lion King when I was about 5-6 years old or so, and I thought that it was actually a damn good movie. Then, I have not heard about Kimba the White Lion or the alleged copyright claims. It's kind of just a pity that Disney did not make a Kimba re-make instead of their own, and then the humans are okay since it is a remake.

Or maybe Disney themselves think that their plot is the best...?

The human plot ,while a bit unnecessary , did provide a backbone to the series but it is overdone in the traditional sense. If The Lion King was a remake, I could see humans being the minor characters /villains at best while the animals are at the forefront like Rise of the Planet of the Apes because otherwise, the film would not be as good. I agree with you on that.

But if it were done as Kimba , I think it would have possibly diverted from the dub and took direct inspiration from the manga because Disney wasn't afraid to have deaths and some violence as NBC was. And since it's animated and Disney, they could get away with it . I do like Timon and Pumbaa though.[/QUOTE]yeha Timon and Pumbaa is pretty funny I wasn't referring to the disney at that time in the Lion King where some deaths indeed.

Toy story was more the less the blame for it though i do like that films it was de gateway to those 3d movies and for some reason they where more and more for little kids like Cars and stuff that's just trash a cheap way to sell merchandise for years to come for some reason because i don't even get why they promoting the hell out of it that particular title.