Thoughts on the new Astroboy cartoon?

[Xenomage]

Greetings all you fellow Astroboy fans. Well, Ive seen the first 4 episodes of the totally new show and Im still not sure what to think. Actually Im hoping they will get better action-wise because so far they have been pretty weak...

While the visual quality, sound quality and over-all production values are better, the show is suffering from what I think has befallen all anime since Dragonball Z unfortunately... Which is to say there is alot of drawn out plot development, smack talk and constipated yelling that leads up to a very brief and unsatisfying bout of action.

The 80's Astroboy was all about action it seemed. The little guy was always wound up and ready to kick somethings butt at a moments notice, and never hesitated to tear apart anything that stood in his way. The new Astro has gotten pummeled a few times and seems very hesitant to lift his finger to do battle or even defend anything.. A stark contrast, even when comparing the first episode of each era.

I do like the new plot developments though, and am still enjoying the show for the most part, but it just doesnt deliver action-wise the same way the 80's version did.
And not only that but it seems like there is more commercial time per half hour during the new episodes than any other show Ive seen to date. I swear well over 1/3 of the half hour is commercials.. So much that I actually feel a little ripped off by how little of the show I get to watch before having to wait a week for the next episode...

Well, please tell me what you guys think. Do you also feel that there isnt enough Astro action in the new show? Do you feel that its too influenced by modern anime trends? Maybe its just because he's rediscovering his powers and the action will steadily improve, or maybe its just me... Either way I am glad to see the little guy reborn again. Hopefully it wont be his last incarnation.

Oh, and the 80's Atlas was way cooler too!

[Haruka-chan]

Hmmm ok i beg to differ in many areas with you hear. Firstly though let me say i have been watching the uncut Japanese version for eipsodes 1-9 (minus 8) in order while i gather you have been watching the KidsWB dubb dub of episodes 1-4 which are out of order anyway.

Firstly i can't think of ANY anime as badly drawn out storywise as DragonBallZ. I quite enjoy the story and the manga is great but for the anime the producers stretched this continual story over as many episodes as possible resulting if a feeling that not much at all has been accomplished each episode (especially if half an episode was someone powering up to a new level *rolls eyes*). In contrast each Astro Boy episode has its own resolution, even the 2 part Atlas and Atlas vs Astro episodes. Each episode is almost self contained and can be watched out of order if you so choose (a la what KWB are doing).

I'm also rather glad that astro's development has been drawn out a little more in this new series. It's added a LOT more depth to characters such as Tobio and Tenma compared with the 80's series. Although besides that i find the structure of the episodes very simillar. Eg in the 80's series a little story would unfold with some complications which built up to a problem that Astro had to solve. Cue the great opening theme music and Astro overcomes the problem and then there is a resolution (my favourite bit of the 80's series was waiting for the theme music to come on and see Astro fix everything up so i sorta miss the old theme music playing triumphantly). The new series simillarly follows this layout.

I also don't believe that 80's Astro was all about action....Being a super hero it is natural that his powers are needed in some form during the episodes to hold a continum. But Astro never sets out to have a fight. Lets take... Lily of Peligro Island for an example. Astro finds a message in a bottle asking for help. Of course being a robot and having a strong sense of justice he goes off to help Lily. The action of the story being a bout with the undersea mining structure and people who are imprisoning others to work there. The point of the story in this case is Astro building a relationship with Lily while trying to help her and the feelings he and she have. How she is hurt when she thinks he is killed not knowing he is a robot.

Astro's stories always have a purpose and a moral in the 80's series. Because he fights for justice and is a powerful superhero it is only natural he has to use his powers every now and then but i stress Astro is not soley and 'action' show and i don't think i would like it as much if it weren't for it's humanity.

The new Astro has gotten pummeled a few times and seems very hesitant to lift his finger to do battle or even defend anything.. A stark contrast, even when comparing the first episode of each era.

Here again i totally disagree. In both series (80's and new) Astro is heitant to fight when he is young and innocent. As you may have noticed in the new series his development from a childlike state takes longer than the 80's. By the 4th English dub (5th Japanese) episode Astro has lost mostly all of his innocence to the human way of life and understands his position and can control his powers. By the 6th and 7th new series episodes (3rd & 4th English dubb) Astro has just discovered a new power, about Tobio, his past and who created him. His development time is significantly obvious.

In both series Astro doesn't hesitate to protect humans, but he still cares for robots. Even after throwing the robot car into the ocean in the first 80's episode Astro is sad. In the first episode of the new series Astro protects the humans but still doesn't want to harm the robot and will try to solve things without a fight. The core is obviously more willing to talk than the robot car which didn't apologise to Astro as he took it away from the humans.

If anything the new Astro is a little more caring and tries even harder to work out issues before using violence. I think that seeing more episodes of the new series (dubbed in your case) is needed before a judgement can be made anyway. If action is more in your interest maybe you should look at some other anime? Personally i hope Astro sticks with the characters and relationships and has a nice balance of action to that. A little more adventure to fill the feeling of the old series would be nice but that will require me seeing more episodes ^_^

And not only that but it seems like there is more commercial time per half hour during the new episodes than any other show Ive seen to date.

Each episode is 24-25 minutes long including opening closing and next episode preview. This is a standard time for all 30min slot anime series these days. Unfortunately with cutting for the dubb and then cutting for time this reduces the amount of Astro you see on KidsWB to under 20minutes at a guess. Lets just all hope for uncut bilingual DVDs

[DrFrag]

I haven't seen the new English dub so I can't comment on it, but I totally agree with the way things have gone since Dragonball Z.

I get really sick of the characters all prepared to battle and just standing around trash talking each other. The tournament animes are the worst for this. In Yu-Gi-Oh for example (which I don't mind), the dialogue might go something like:

"I will play a card that you have no hope of stopping!"
"Whatever you play is no match for my vomitting dragon! Ha ha ha ha!"
"You're all talk, but I'm all action! I have a secret card which I am about to play that will shatter all your defences!"
"You're bluffing! There is no card greater than the vomitting dragon!"
"We'll see about that!"
"(could he possibly have a more powerful card?)"
"Prepare to be defeated, as I play this incredibly powerful card! With this one card, I will bla bla bla"

At this point I'm screaming "PLAY THE DAMN CARD ALREADY!" Well not really, as I don't talk to the TV. But this kind of thing really drags on.

And when it came to Dragonball Z where they had some fights lasting OVER 50 EPISODES, and with the majority of it padded out with trash talk . . . argh!

[Dragonrider1227]

Yeah. I used to like Dragonball Z but after while, it seemed to be 30 minutes of yelling, grunting, and blowing stuff up. I don't think the villains were getting any stronger. Just grunting louder. But anyway, back on topic,
The new series would have to be my favorite version of the series. Second only to the manga. I didn't grow up with the 80s or 60s versions so I can't speak for it the same way you all can. However, Xenomage does make a point that the new Astro could stand up and fight a little more, but being mentally nine, I would want to fight anyone either.

[Xenomage]

In reply to Haruka-chan:

I did say that I do like the new plot developments. I think the new characterizations of our old favorites (except Atlas apearance) are well done and the story is very interesting. I do imagine that the action will get a bit better as Astro starts 're-discovering' himself and his abilities.

My main concern is the flow of events leading up to and around any action sequences. It seems that Im not the only one who thinks that the trends in modern anime make for very uninspiring combat (trends which seem to have started apearing in the early 90's, around the exact same time Dragonball was insanely popular). I havent felt satisfied with any of it the same way I was satisfied with the action in the original.

Yes, the 80's Astro never set out looking for a fight, but he was not hesitant to take the fight to the enemy, even in the very first episode where he immidiately rushes to stop the out-of-control car (and does a nice job of beating the poo out of it before finishing it off). In the new series he watches as Atlas destroys things left and right and keeps declaring "I dont want to fight you.." while Atlas says "fine" and continues his rampage unabated for a good while..
Your right, The new Astro is more willing to work things out, and while thats a fine moral demonstration for the kids it doesnt set up the action in the same way.

And I never bothered to do any exact calculations but both my girlfriend and I were blown away by the amount of commercial time that played during the premier episode. I think the latest few werent as bad but I cant really say more than that. We do watch it on a different channel (YTV) so maybe that has something to do with it.

Anyway Im glad Im not the only one who feels that action sequences in anime are very lacking lately... Alot of flare and drama but no real punch... Just look at the original duels between Atlas and Astro compared to the new ones. They didnt sit there and babble at each other, they got right to duking it out..

[Haruka-chan]

I think the new characterizations of our old favorites (except Atlas apearance)

Just in case you didn't know Atlas character design in the new series is that of the original manga. The 80's had a totally different design to Tezuka's original. Anyone seen enough of the 60's to tell me if Atlas appeared there? I gather so but in what design?

trends in modern anime make for very uninspiring combat

Curious.... what do you call modern anime? Are you a big anime fan who goes out and buys a lot of DVDs, watches newly fansubbed shows just out in Japan? Or do you sit in your comfy home watching whatever comes on the telly eg Pokemon Yu-Gi-Oh and DragonBallZ? Being an anime club executive and spending a lot of my time with an active club that shows a wide variety of anime from the very new to stuff in the 80s/90s to it's members i have to say that i feel i have seen enough variety in the "modern anime" that i think your statement on this is quite unjust. But let me rephrase it and i'll agree: MOST anime released on COMMERCIAL tv DUBBED tends to be lacking in action these days. Although as i have said before i like my anime to have a balance, it doesn't have to be all action to grab me.

We do watch it on a different channel (YTV) so maybe that has something to do with it.

I dunno what the difference between the amount of ads on KidsWB and YTV is but i've heard the dubb from both channels is exactly the same so you're missing about 5min or so of the action. I still suggest you have a look at the uncut Japanese episodes and watch some more of the dubb before making a heavy handed judgement. As for myself the dubb will be on cable/satellite here in a bit over a month so i'll comment on what i see then. Personally i'd like the series to take on a little bit more of the feel from the 80's series that i think it missing....but i don't think that is neccessarily just action but also a piece of Astro's personality. I'm sure when we see the episodes where he is big brother to his little sister he will have changed quite a bit.

[Xenomage]

Ive never seen any of the original series but what you say about Atlas is interesting. I like most things about the new Atlas, especially how he resembles Astro in alot more ways, but for some reason I just prefer the 80's version better.

Your right, I refer primarily to any of the series that come on the TV. I dont watch much else in the way of movie anime because what little bit Ive seen of it doesnt come across as being much different in structure. If you have some good recommendations for really action oriented movies Id love to hear them. maybe Ive just been unlucky with my previous viewing selection..
However, Its not a high action/plot ratio that Im particularily looking for. It is the pacing of the action that it important to me. Once the action sequence begins I would like to see steady intense combat for a good measure of time. At least 2 or 3 minutes of pure action an episode. With the new astroboy (and much TV anime) most of the time (at least so far) is spent building up to a climax that, after some grunting and discharging of power, is resolved with only one or two blows delivered. I liked the 80's version because when Astro confronted an enemy they would immidiately start battling and steadily beat each other up for at least a couple of minutes, and there would usually be more than one good battle per episode.

I can say that 5 minutes of missing show/added commercial makes quite a difference, and I imagine that is the case. Of course thats all Ive seen so thats all I can judge by. I would love to see the uncut subtitled version because personally I like foreign film better subtitled than dubbed (plus getting to enjoy all the parts that are inevitably cut), but I dont think Ill get the chance unless they are released on dvd sometime.

These are of course just my impressions after the first four episodes. I do have confidence the show will steadily improve. So far it just seems that its off to a slower start.

[tinlunlau]

I saw about 3 episodes of it so far on YTV. And i like the style in storytelling it uses. it seemed to me that it is more glossy than the old series. it's still good. it's too bad that my memories of the 80s version is so vague as i was just a mere toddler when i watched it on Global TV and TVOntario (the french channel)

[Big Astro Fan]

Boy do I feel old. I remember some of the B&W series.